Finding Intimacy - Can God fulfill my need for intimacy?
Susie:
Kyle:
Susie:
So this is where Susie and I are in our relationship right now. It's all messed up.
She does have an excellent point that she cannot fill my need for intimacy. But what I need help understanding is what can I expect of her to fulfill my need for intimacy? My other question is what is her picture of intimacy in our relationship? I have doubts that we will be able to make progress without the help of a professional. However, I don't think we have the time for this at this point in our lives. We have just too much going on.
God, help me to depend on you for my intimacy. I don't think you can do it. Prove me wrong. Please.
I find it so hard to relate to Susie because of her strong devotion in her faith compared to my lukewarm faith.
Her comment, "I am not ever going to fill the level of intimacy that you desire..." has been a tough one to take. I think I know what she is getting at. She's trying to say that I am the one that is responsible for creating a sense of purpose and meaning in my life. That makes sense. But the reason it is so hard to hear, I think, is because I want to have a greater level of intimacy with Susie than we currently have, but even more disheartening is that I (and this is the part that is so difficult, almost debilitating really; very, very difficult) is that I don't feel that she has a desire to work toward a more intimate relationship between us. That must be it, because as I type this now I find it difficult to even press the keys to put these words together. Please Susie, please God, help me to help Susie to have a desire for us to have an intimate relationship. God this is hard. For the better part of 20 years this has been an issue and I want to start working now for us to reconcile this over the next 20 years.
Today Susie and I talked and it went about like I expected. Except, in the end, Susie was put off by something (I think) and I was more hurt about the situation than when we started. However, I talked to Pete Hopkins and it was good. I shed a few tears and it was so good to just have someone to listen and share the pain for just a moment. So good. (I also mentioned it to Adam today after church and that felt somewhat good too. I may mention it to Matt tomorrow if the opportunity presents itself.
My next task will be finding another time that we can talk. And hopefully, these times away are a chance for us to bond while she gets a little break from the tasks of parenting.
Maybe I can have some sort of Christian conversion and turn this whole thing around. I don't really believe in God that much so that is going not a likely scenario, but it is one way this whole thing could improve, at least get back on track. .
Thursday, July 22
Had a horrible dream last night about Susie playing strip pool with two other younger guys. The guys weren't necessarily impressive just about couple of random dudes that Susie was enjoying their company and decided to take part in this fun and adventurous activity with. In my mind I envisioned walking in on Susie and the two guys. One guy was in just pants. One guy was in just underware. Susie was completely nude. I gently guided her into a private closest and she consented as an obedient and indifferent partner might respond to be caught in this act. The thought of it started me in the night and cause another poor night of sleep. In trying to put my finger on why this dream it is difficult. But I believe it may be this. It hurts because she is choosing to engaging in this fun and sexual activity with others when it is something I would enjoy but she is not interesting in including me in this part of her life. Man. That hurts. I will talk to her this weekend, demand it if I have to. What I want to do is revisit some of the things we talked about last week like her interpretation of what I said about the young men that died in a canoe accident several years ago. I also want to see if she understands me when I say that I desire intimacy, not sex. Finally, I want to hear her tell me where she sees our relationship going into the future. I also want to tell her that I understand that she is in constant physical and emotional demand from our family.
Thursday, July 29
Susie and I talked Tuesday morning and Wednesday afternoon this week. Though the conversation was good and I feel like I am feeling more connected to Susie it was hard to hear some of the things from the conversation. In particular, Susie said that we will also have differences in our faith that will prevent us from ever really being that close. She said we have some major differences that she knows we just won't be able to work through that is going to keep us from ever being that close. I asked what differences and she said in our faith. And that that will always be something that prevents us from being that close. I said I disagree and that we could work through that. She said she doesn't believe we can ever work through it. I said she is wrong. And I said that makes me sad. She said it makes her sad too. Time will tell but I do think we can talk about these things if we ever get to the point that we have more trust in each other. I haven't been a good trust builder in our relationship. In fact I've probably been pretty terrible at it. On the other hand, Susie has high expectations of me that I will never be able to reach. But, as we continue to work through stuff I think the trust will come and as our kids age and life gets less busy with kids I will be able to keep my promises better.
Thursday, August 26
I email Susie on Monday morning and said we need to talk. We picked Thursday and after I got home from work we drove to Home Depot and had a talk. It was a humbling if not humiliating conversation. Susie basically said that she's independent and doesn't need emotional support from me. I told her that it would be nice in our relationship to lean on each other for emotional support to some level. She went on to tell me that "she dreads" it when our kids are out of the house because I will be needing her for my emotional well being. She said that I need to find things that I can do on my own that give me an outlet to be more independent. It was seriously humiliating. I told her that I don't do that because I don't have any freedom. That our lives are too busy and that I get one week a year to feel independent when I travel to Missouri. She said that maybe if I like the handiman work I should pursue that. Oh my gosh. There is some honesty to what she is saying and maybe I need to own it more. Part of me is yelling, it is your control that keeps me depending on you. And part of me is crying, I really am a pathetic man dependent on my wife's approval. (I told myself that I would skip church once a month and go hiking but I didn't do it. Why not? I knew it would be the best thing for me but for some reason, either laziness or fear of disappointing my family, I didn't do it. The hike to Nambe Lake is calling my name. Why don't I just go?!) And I do have hobbies. I do the blackberries and I fix the house and the cars and watch sports. Even have a beer with the fellas once in a while. I think I am just a crappy companion. Never was good at being a friend and now it has push my wife away. My wife who was the weak and dependent one at the beginning of our marriage has become the one that I cannot do without. Part of me feels like it's my fault for not being more proactive in going out with friends and part of me feels like it's Susie's fault for forcing me into this crazy life with six kids with ages that will span most of my Goddam adulthood taking care of them, check that, helping her take care of them. Maybe if I would have just took a leap and got a real job instead of the mom-like job as a teacher I would be that more independent and confident person that she wants. It is quite depressing. This book we're reading talks about a calling. I think it would be good for me to consider my calling instead of looking at my job as how I identify with my work. Well, these conversations with Susie are healing but they are tough. Very tough. I don't even know if I want to do it again next week but hopefully some time we will have a breakthrough. Though I'm not sure one hour a week is going to get us very far. Well, hopefully I will continue to be honest and that will help me find myself and find myself in the context of our relationship.
Conversation with Susie on Saturday morning, October 9:
Susie: So i'll just go to half of Simon's baseball game and you'll go to the other half of the game.
Kyle: Sure. I'm just wondering why. I'd kinda like to go the whole game.
Susie: Anna has been watching Esther during all of his games so I thought it would be nice for her to have a break. And since Esther has had COVID she can't go with us.
40 minutes later after I went to the store...
Susie: So, Anna is going to watch Esther so we can both go to the game.
Kyle: OK. That was just weird how we weren't both going to the game together. That's what we usually do.
Susie: I just wanted to give Anna a break. Do you think I had some alterior motive or something?
Kyle: Yeah, I guess kinda. I wanted to know if you just wanted to be alone.
Susie: That wasn't the reason, and if I did would that be a problem?
Kyle: No. If that was the reason I just wanted to know.
Susie: I can't believe you would think that or that this would bother you.
Kyle: Yes is bothers me. This is such a tough time for me and I am very sensitive to these things. For one of us this is a really painful thing and with another it is just like this is totally chill.
End conversation.
Conversation on Sunday afternoon on the way to Cohort Leardership meeting at church and drive through at Starbucks.
Kyle: So I'm wondering what you are thinking as far as meeting with Scott. Do you want to meet with him or do you want to meet together? You don't have to have an answer now but I'm meeting next Tuesday so maybe try to have an answer by then.
Susie: Yeah. I'm not sure. I'll have to think about it.
Moment of silence.
Kyle: This is just a difficult time so i'm thinking maybe I should try to find a roommate.
...(I can't recall the order of the comments at this point. My stress level must have went way up.)
Susie: It was really frustrating when you thought I had alterior motives about going to the game yesterday. That really pissed me off!
Kyle: I didn't mean to make you think I thought you had alterior motives. I just wanted to know if you wanted to be alone or not. I should have just asked you that. I am not good with communication.
Susie: You say you want this great connection but what does that mean? (I can't really remember what Susie said here.)
Kyle: Right now there is no connection at all. I mean I don't know what you are thinking at all. I have no idea where this is headed.
Kyle: I just want to know what is going. If I don't know what your thinking it makes it so hard. We don't communicate so I don't know what you're thinking. I can deal with whatever. You need to do what you need to do and I don't know where this is going. Whatever happens I'm cool with. But i would like to know what is going on. It is very difficult for me when I just don't know what is going on.
Conversation after the Leadership Cohort on the drive home.
Susie: I don't think it would be good to have a roommate. That would not be good for the kids. Simon heard what you were saying the other day (Saturday morning). And he asked what is the deal with dad? I said I don't know you'll have to ask him.
You know how you say you want desire for God but it's just not there. We'll I would like to have affection for you but I just don't feel that. If I could I would but it's just not there. And I don't know what to do about it. I don't know what to say or do.
Kyle: Yeah. So, I think we should both meet with Scott.
This is hard for me because you have been processing this for like, what 10 years?, who know for how long. And for me it hasn't always been great but I've been working toward it and was always investing in the relationship. But now that is all changing all of a sudden so it is really hard. For me. I hope you can understand how hard this is for me.
Conversation ends as we pull in the driveway and Simon is waiting to talk to us in the window of the van. My comments are basically cut off mid-sentence.
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